PWD for evaluation of cost OK. Then I am also required to get that 25sqm area extra what is known as conversion certificate for converting from agricultural to non-agricultural purposes so that is conversion. So these three NOCs are required so the plan first goes to what you call that the first NOC from PDA, directly you go to PDA for approval of that plan so what they do is that you submit the file there, after submission they take around 1 week or 2 weeks, they give you a date for site inspection OK. Engineer comes for site inspection he sees how much area is there, whether site is actually there, setback from road and all those things and then he approves the plan, from there.

Of course in between many objections are raised like say distance from road to the structure, that might not have been put correctly, they’ll say it has to be written, exact distance, exact distance from well. OK, all those small small things and then if there is some fault in the architects plan for which they want more clarification… you know (for instance) if it is not clear. Sometimes what happens is that blue print is not clear so numbers cannot be seen clearly so they ask for resubmitting, so in this way it is delayed it doesn’t happen in 15 days say (it takes) about a month for site inspection. After site inspection (file) the came back (to the office) he saw that whole thing and he went back…err ...ya …and then the approval was given from the technical point of view, that time you have to pay tax also. Now the thing is, what is there you know they have something called tax for area so I assumed that it is a tax for built up area but when they calculate what they say is that your area is 4000 sqm. tax you have to pay is, minimum tax for this is 10Rs./sqm or whatever value so they calculate it by 4000sqm so I argued with him that see tax should be for this what I am building you cannot charge for whole area. You have to pay this much but I will work out something and make you for this area only so you know so you give me something of that so you understand otherwise you would have suffered so much. So this factor is very important layman always gets confused there and this happens also at the deputy collectors office where you go to obtain conversion certificate so when a layman goes there who doesn’t know he says my god my area is 4000sqm even if they take 5Rs/ sqm, how much money I’ll have to pay, so he says okay baba you only do it, I’ll give you something so he says I’ll do everything don’t worry but there is something fishy in this because it cannot be either way, if there is proper PDA rule which says it is for entire area then this officer is doing some cheating, which he would definitely not do because it will come during audit when they do total and will be found out otherwise he is just trying to get something out of it.

So okay that thing is cleared off, I had to give him 500 for coming and going or whatever but he was still grumbling he said I saved you so much I said I know and forget it so that was obtained then the next is PWD for calculating the cost that is easier because they don’t come for site inspection that time they just calculate the cost, the estimate of the house is two and half lakhs or whatever getting these two NOCs I had to come back to aah conversion; conversion when you go for conversion you have to apply to deputy collector, then it goes to mamledar , actually panchayat says that at the time of obtaining occupancy certificate you have to have NOC from PDA from technical point of view, from PWD for evaluation of cost and from conversion because you have converted agricultural land to non-agricultural land, simultaneously you can apply, the conversion thing is called sanad, you have to make two files, one goes to deputy collector, one file goes to mamledar and one file goes to town and country planning, now in this file you have to give your Form 1/14 property documents, your plan what is that is called block conversion plan means when your building a residential house you have to give a certain 4m 4m 4m 4m and make a block, that is called block conversion this is different from architects plan so why they keep 4m 4m is that in future suppose if you want to extend then again you need not come for conversion so leaving 4m on all sides you have to make that plan (construction plan done by architect), blue print of that and give to deputy collector, Mamledar and town and country planning.

Now first it goes to Mamledar’s office, it is called conversion plan. File is submitted to Mamledar, they ask for site inspection, again they will come, again the same thing, they will see if really house is there, you know how much area you have asked for, is it close to road, is it encroaching something so once they are satisfied with that file goes to town and country planning again they see the same thing, setback from road, well distance you know all that your ownership rights and all that once these two are satisfied the deputy collector gives you…. this takes more than one month mine is lying there for three months why again it is lying there, the thing is that the head clerk who is there in deputy collectors office, he is telling me, but I didn’t pick up confrontation with him, he is telling me at present conversion rate in Xandolim is 15 Rs/sqm, so he is telling me for your 4000sqm area how much will it be 15 multiply by 4000;again this natak (drama) starts here, how much money you’ll have to pay? Once I argued with him, is charge is 60000 (f it) is what I have to pay as conversion tax here okay and if it is so simple then why you have to send this file to town and country planning? Why you have to send it to Mamledar? You just charge straight no. What do you need block plan? For that, no body knows the rules

Question: There is no rule….

Shri Gauns: Nobody shows you, nobody knows about rules

Question: If you ask?

Shri Gauns: They have to show; but you don’t because they’ll find some thing and keep your file pending architect also doesn’t know the rules, you ask them about this rule, exactly this is the problem, I had this problem in past, you ask them for clarification, you say I want to see the rule, they say you go and find out yourself; building construction rules. If you challenge them on that they’ll say “you show me the rule”, its always the same thing I don’t know why they do that but they put it back on you, you go hunt and show me, otherwise you listen to me, tu mhaka shanpona sangu naka (you don’t give me lessons). “If you know rules you bring.”

This is again a trick to make money from you, but it is so simple and logical that when you are going for conversion you are converting that area so you are supposed to be charged for that area it cannot be that; minimum yes minimum you can understand say minimum 200. (Rupees), suppose I am adding 1sqm area then minimum is 200 but not 4000, okay but he wont show you things he’ll say you go and all that.

Question:Have you tried to clarify it elsewhere?

Shri Gauns: No, it fails, and even if some officers in department know I don’t think they’ll be ready to reveal because every thing goes hand in glove okay so the thing is that.

So after you get from there am going to come with Sanad, NOC from town and country planning, NOC from PWD and I am going to submit it to panchayat saying that I got the necessary approval and kindly issue me whatever that occupancy certificate, this file they have to put it in meeting .OK now they put it in the meeting and after that they give it back saying that you get a NOC now okay before that you need a completion certificate from architect saying that house is completed, I don’t have the Sanad , the rule says that at the time of occupancy you can submit the Sanad, so now two up roles I have NOC from PWD and PDA I have put in there completion certificate from architect. They tell me now you get a NOC from PWD (earlier NOC was for evaluation of cost) now they will come and inspect the construction and they will see that it is as per title. They come with tape and every thing and after inspection give the NOC.

Now again you see, one meeting it was already put, actually there was no need to put It in the meeting they could have asked for NOC first, second meeting takes place another…this is all delaying and this is all like, what I feel is that everybody gets the information that you are building a house, the secretary gets, the sarpanch gets the ward member gets, everybody gets, the peon gets everybody gets so they are alert now so they can grab something from you. One notice is put up, and you get the NOC from PWD, they come measure and give NOC now you again submit it to panchayat again it is put up on notice board after that meeting they give occupancy certificate. Then you have to again apply for electrical connection and from health, these two things.

Now what is happening you know if you know somebody there, they will give you occupancy without getting sanad, the risk is up to you, if secretary is good to me, then he’ll say I’ll give you, but you bring it somehow later and submit. If somebody complains it becomes a problem otherwise there is no problem and then finished.

… When you put into meeting, you have to go and meet ward member to tell them you know; otherwise they delay, they might not put in meeting, secretary will delay in writing minutes or somebody else will delay they have all these delays….

When it is a big construction you might have to pay something, give something; matshe kar begin (please expedite) This is small construction just 3 lakhs investment but there are big things which are coming of 70-80 lakhs from that major chunk is going off. Even the lowest of construction at least 100, 200, 500, 1000 goes off without it work doesn’t expedite.

Question: Even ward member takes …

Shri Gauns: Even ward member takes, but they didn’t take from me because I have not given. At the secretary level I had to give because I didn’t have sanad.

Question: That was the way of overcoming

Shri Gauns: Yes yes, because I have an immediate neighbour who will complain and I’ll lose the law so it is like a small baxis (gift) or whatever you give him a party otherwise you take him for dinner and give him good food.

Question: It is not openly said …

Shri Gauns: No no, nothing is openly said but without doing something it is just impossible, I saw my compound work construction file, which was cleared by every department, every thing was clear, title was clear, it came in the meeting, it was about to pass when this neighbour of mine went to the town planning chief he got something saying that his way is getting blocked or something and on that he sent a letter to panchayat saying that certain things have come to me, a letter of complaint, kindly check, look into this matter and let me know. On that ground taking help of that they stopped my construction. This way it happens and it stuck there for long time in spite of having all documents clear because then you will have to fight against panchayat, you will have to complain to director of panchayat again they are hand in glove then you’ll have to go to court by that time your work is lost so the man’s say says if I am building a house of 3 lakhs then I expect something in return, I have put money into it, might be a loan or what ever now just because of 1000 or something. If it is stopping for five years then I am going to loss tremendously so this is the way people give money, initially I never gave money, this is the first time I am giving money. (I was very much against this but there is just no way avoid it.)

(Towards the end he mentioned that the whole system is designed so that persons could ‘make money’. He illustrated this by saying that (1) Though the Panchayat is supposed to send files to PDA, PWD etc. They make the entries and give the file to the petitioner who has to himself carry the file. Secondly he says that the Sirpanch marks the file to the PDA but the PWD it is the Dy. Sirpanch who is required to mark the file. This he says is only to give the Dy. Sirpanch too an opportunity to mediate the file and the mediation permitting options for negotiations)


CASE 2-A
An interview with the brother of an applicant for the State Interest Free Loan Scholarship for students.
J is the brother of the applicant, while M is the initial of the interviewer.

J: Now what happens is that my brother had got admission to a university abroad. We had heard of the loan scheme, where you got 150% of the tuition fee as an interest free loan to help Goan students to go abroad for higher studies.

My brother had got a scholarship, which covered his tuition fees, from the institute he was to study in, but he still needed money to cover his living expenses. My father spoke with one of the lower officers in the Department, and he indicated that the scheme was really only for tuition, but we decided to try our luck anyways, perhaps we would be able to argue that the scholarship that was given could cover some of the other expenses?

So he applied for the loan. I don’t think that it was a very difficult process, there were these documents that he had to get, like a domicile certificate, show that he had got admission in the university and such like. He waited till the last moment to get his work done, which is why he was a bit tense, but then the deadline for submitting the forms had also been extended. You see the news of the scheme suddenly appeared in the newspapers one day and there were, I believe some Government holidays in between, so the time limit was extended.

So he submitted the application form, and was told that he would be called for a second round of interview. This submission of the application for the loan was considered the first round. He was not going to be in the country by the time of the second round, so he was told that his parents could fill in for him and take the money on his behalf.

Eventually a letter came for the interview for the second round of screening, an interview with the Director of the department. The applicant and the guarantor were required to be present at specified date and time.

Now, what happens is that my brother (the applicant) had already moved abroad to commence his course, while our parents were in Delhi. You see, my father was ill with a serious disease and undergoing treatment in hospital for the same. Faced with these circumstances what I was advised to do was to attend the meeting and see what it was about and what could be done.

I went with entire files, certificates of my brother, and filled in a form, it was more of a registration form for the day which required details of receipt number, names, what was the extent of finance required etc. I did not know what was the finance required, but they made an exception owing to the circumstances, i.e. since I was only representing parties that could not be there.

M: Who made the exception?

J: The Director of the Department. When my turn came up, I put the papers in front of him, and he said that since I was neither applicant nor guarantor, no decision could be taken on that date. But he recognized who I was, as my brother has met with him earlier. I explained the circumstances, he extended the time till November; the interview was somewhere in mid October, at which point of time, the mother would have to be present for meeting with the director.

The meeting ended, and he gave another appointment for the scholarship. He noted that my brother was a very likely candidate for the aid, as he was a known candidate from another scholarship interview process. A scholarship that once again the Government was providing, only this other scholarship was not a loan but a grant

Between the said dates mother spoke with the Director, and he said that she did not have to worry, to come only when she was ready, my brother would get his loan, and that we had no reason to worry.

The day of the interview, mummy could not make it to Goa, so she called the Director, when he said that a format had to be filled and a bond signed, depending on the amount of loan, which was not given to me earlier, i.e. when I went to fill in for my brother and parents.

Since no such thing was done, the format would have to be prepared. Now I was not in Goa on that day but I was located, and got the format done via a friend, who did it on the same day, on stamp paper.

After this was done, mother could still not make it, and still the Director said don’t worry, you will get the loan.

The situation moves on, the treatment was over, my parents got back to Goa, and Mum decided that it was time to go and follow up on the loan. Again with all the documents and the format, we met with the Director. But before this we mentioned to the Director that we wanted more money, 3 rather than 2 lakhs, he dug out application, and asked for the course fees. Now as per the guidelines I was entitled to only 150% of the tuition fee, once converted into rupees from euros, the tuition fee turned out to be not even a lakh, so it appeared that this loan would not be possible.

So he said let mother come and we can further discuss it. Mother went and explained that it was living expense that takes more money. He agreed, but the guidelines did not allow this. Mother offered to show the other receipts to prove the cost of living expenses.

Once that topic was over, he started discussing daddy’s health, and it came up that we knew a member of the Chief Minister’s family. Since we were known to this family, and he requested not to be quoted he said that there are other ways of getting it done.

Put your case forward as a special case, and this could be taken up by the CM and if found appropriate the loan amount would be sanctioned.

First put forward your special case application he said, put it in writing. So I went to meet Secretary of the department, and explained my situation and the cost of living expenses, and hence the reason for asking for more. Put it in writing he said, and why you need it. I did not mention my connections. Address this application to the Director as per instructions of Secretary. He said that the same file will be routed through me (Secretary) and I will approve.

M: Why was he so helpful?

J: Maybe he saw the genuine case? No, he (the Director) did not speak with the Secretary to make matters easier. We did not ask for three lakhs either, don’t ask me why, my mother thought that it was not proper, we asked only for 2 and the application was put.

I then left to Bangalore and I think my father followed the matter, and he called the Director, who said that it would be sent to the CM’s office first, then to the Sales office...

M: Sales?

J: I don’t know what the procedure was, what this was. So anyway it would to the Sales office, approved again, and once approved, would come back to his office, after which the loan would be sanctioned.

Basically I realized that there was no need for so called influence. Because once the Director, heard mother quote the CM’s relative’s name, there was no need for direct intervention at all. That is why I think Director took a little more interest, plus the father’s illness.

Also, I want to mention that at no point did I face any problem with the people involved. I did not have photographs, no problem, I did not have the course fees, no problem, I did not have the receipts, no problem. They were very helpful.

Case 2-B
A recounting of the experience of another applicant of the State Interest Free Loan Scholarship for students.

I was in first year then I read about this scheme in one of the daily newspaper. All the specifications and eligibility criteria were mentioned in it. I found myself eligible so I decided to apply for this scheme.

I went to DTE office to get the application form (place was mentioned in the newspaper). Since I was applying for the first time I was a little bit nervous and also curious .I first read all the details about the scheme, which were documented in the brochure. So I filled the form but to make it complete some more documents were required they are as follows

Since just before a month I had to collect all these certificates for my admission procedure I didn’t had to struggle a lot. For this scheme they wanted just the self-attested photocopies. So I prepared everything and submitted the application form at the office of the department.

Then after a few days later I was called for the interview. Where the personnel (I think he is an advocate) asked me some formal questions. Here I was supposed to decide on how much loan amount I want to seek. According to the conditions given in the brochure I could have taken a loan up till Rs.50000/- but here in interview due to some financial problems or so they asked me to decide in amount up to Rs.7000/-. So I decided to take a loan of Rs.35000/-. Then that person sent me to another person who is a notary. This person gave me the proforma of the bond and he also told me to prepare an affidavit since I haven’t had turned 18 till then. So after that I came home.

So now I went to the notary to prepare a bond and also the affidavit. Of course my father was there with me during all this process. So we prepared the bond and affidavit gave it to the person at the office who was supposed to collect the forms from all the people. This person told us that the loan disbursal date would be published very soon on the daily newspapers. He also said that we would be sent a letter about the same.

So after a few days later the disbursal date was told to us by telephone, but instead of full amount they told us that they would give loan in two installments.

So during the first installment a function was organized where all dignitaries because of whom this scheme could be launched were present.

Among them was our CM.

For second installment we were called to the department office. This time my father went there to take the cheque, he also took my identity card. There they were hesitating to give cheque to my father even when he showed my card. They said that they would give the cheque only to the concerned student. Since I was in college, he could not contact me but he directly went and met the director of this scheme, he is my father’s friend, and told him the entire story so in his witness they gave the cheque to my father. Thus was all the process during first year.

During second year, a notice came in one of the daily newspaper, about where you will get forms for second year, they specified only PCC college & GEC so I asked my brother to collect form from his college. So he brought the form. We filled the form and submitted at the department office but the people there told me that, that form is to be filled by 1st year students so I brought another form and filled it. This time I had only to give fee receipt and bonafide certificate. My father submitted the form at the office and in return they gave him Performa of bond and asked to prepare a bond of Rs. 560/. So accordingly we prepared the bond. This time we didn’t prepare the affidavit since I had past 18.so we submitted the bond at the office. For first installation we were allowed to take up till 37000/-, but this time they made different rule, rule was this way – we can take a loan of 150% of our tuition fees. So we could get only 27000/- this time. This time cheque came by post so it was very smooth and easy process, or rather I should say this process was handled very well.

Third time, now this is the third time I have applied for the scheme, and from the day I went to get the form I started feeling that it has all turned digital. This time I had to get the form from mahiti ghar. They specified some 13-mahiti-ghar names from where we can get forms. Compared to the last times forms cost, this time the form was a lot costlier. Last two times I had to pay only Rs. 10/- to get the form but this time I got the form after paying Rs100/-. The form looked great, was of good quality. The lady there at the mahiti ghar asked us only to fill the form, stick one photo to it, and get one salary certificate, and fee receipt Xerox each attached to the form, and submit it again to her only .so I filled the form completely and submitted the form at the mahiti ghar. My entry was made in the database and after the data entry process I was given a registration number. So if I want to make any enquiry about the changes then I have to go on the GEDCs website enter my registration no and see what changes they have made. So after a few weeks later I again went to mahiti ghar and checked my data. This time they had asked to get the original certificates of, fee receipt and a bonafide certificate, to the EDC house, they also specified the time during which we had to submit the form it was 4-5 in evening. So I went there to submit the form, I reached there at 3:30 pm, since I stay far from Panaji I asked them to collect my documents. They collected my form and told that further changes will be informed on the website. I went on the website after 2 weeks but the same previous things were there no changes were made. One time I thought they didn’t get my original documents, so I made a phone call to that office, the person who received the phone told me just wait on the line and after sometime the call got disconnected, I again made a call but nobody received it.

So now I decided to go to the office itself and see what has gone wrong. So when I got there the personnel there told me the they have not made any changes yet, and probably they will make the changes by next weekend so just to hear these four five words I had to go to Panaji.

I felt I had spent a lot of time traveling. Also I had to miss some lectures at the college. So I feel till the date I think it was all waste of money and time. The smoothness that was there during first two years is nowhere this time. I don’t like this present method.

Case 3
A recounting of interviews with two beneficiaries of the State Pension scheme and a worker of ruling political party.

The beneficiaries are unaware of the process there cases have either been handled by workers of ruling party or by local MLA. They told us that they signed wherever they were asked to.

Later we talked to local political worker he had following things to say.

“This scheme is actually meant for poor old people who don’t have any source of income and for widows but the well-to-do have received benefits from the scheme in large numbers. You know this Shri PQR he is such a big coconut trader and his father is receiving the cheques. For those whom this scheme is meant are unable to receive benefit because they don’t even have enough money needed to do the formalities, like making affidavit etc. also they are complete illiterates and don’t know how to go about the process.

Taking the form, attaching necessary documents, making affidavit, visiting mamledar’s offices and all such thing at least take Rs. 300. Notary’s fee itself is 100, how will old poor illiterates will manage such things their young children are reluctant to help however when check comes they are there.

Now, I have filled quite a few forms but to do all the formalities I had to pay from my pocket, very few have spent their own money, I did it as a social responsibility but I also have to look after my business. I am not a politician. Politicians can look after these things because they can spend more money, most applications have been looked after by the MLA he just takes care of every thing and these old people believe that he has given them money. And he’ll benefit in elections. If you take money from people even for affidavit they say that they had paid bribes so your name gets spoilt but at the mamledar office you have to give bribe to peon to move file otherwise they ask you to come some other day.

In the beginning some two year ago when the scheme started process was a bit tedious now. CM has made it easy, you need to attach your TEARM (birth certificate) if it is not there then you have to bring two witnesses older then you and they have to give an affidavit that they were present at your marriage. You need to have Xerox of your ration card, if you are a widow you have to give your husbands death certificate etc.

But even after this some forms are rejected because signature is not there or photocopy is missing or some other such reason. But people don’t go to see what has gone wrong they expect you to do that job, when check comes then also they don’t go and see hanka sagle aayte jai (they every thing to be done for them).

Some of the panchs (ward members) have done nice thing, what they have done is that they call mamledar on a specific day to their ward and complete the formalities of the forms from their ward. This way rejection of forms and other inconveniences are reduced considerably. These forms rare available with MLA and also with our office you can also get them from secretariat. Once the forms are filled you have to submit them at social welfare with necessary documents. And after some time you will start getting the money.

In our village, the MLA is from the opposition party and he has used all his financial resources to register a very large number of applicants and as a result the beneficiaries who are ignorant believe that it is he who is giving them the money to them. They think it is his money. Since we are volunteer party workers and do not have too much money to go chasing applications etc., though we belong to the ruling party, our party which has popularized the scheme is not benefiting from it while the opposition MLA is.”

Case 4
A Government officials comments on the situation of her Department which is entrusted with giving subsidies for beneficiaries who purchase pump sets.

There exists little work in office. There is the boss, either because of influence of minister or he has paid the bribe. Suppose an ordinary citizen wants to setup a water pump and claim subsidy on it then he has to go to an approved dealer. There is a specific Performa available with the dealer which needs to be filled by citizen. After this usually citizens pay the price minus subsidy to the dealer. Usually citizens wait till they get the subsidy to pay the remaining balance.

Now the dealer collects several such applications and submits them in the offices, which are inwarded by peon. Now it should be forwarded to the director. But director is busy. So the papers are marked to the accountant. Accountant marks them to the project officer for technical comments. Habitually, the project officer remains busy, all the time. So the dealer has to offer him some gifts during festival seasons, so as to attend the papers in time. You must remember that during all this time file has to be moved by the peon, if he is not happy the file might just lie there.

Now again, the papers come back to the accountant who scrutinises it carefully and thoroughly. Further he verifies and confirms if the money is available. And only then the dealer is informed to install the set. In fact, dealer has already installed the set because if sales price of set is 10000/- it costs him hardly 4000/-. So even if he receives 8000/- from the customer, and the customer keeps the balance till he gets a subsidy of 2000/-, dealer still makes a profit of 4000/- initially.

Before the cheques are issued to the dealer the project officer has to examine the project.

In turn the dealer takes the project officer by car to the place where the sets are installed. JE or the project officer would randomly check some sets during all such visits. JE receives free lunch and such other things as gifts from him. Now the project officer puts his comments on the papers, that the sets are in good working conditions and the cheques may be released. Next, the accountant marks it to his assistant who issues cheques which are routed through the accountant and then the director who signs the cheques. Money (vaazan) must be applied to speed up the process.

(Note: The person interviewed had also informed us earlier of how she had got her position due to political influence.)